Left: Croatian President Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic
at Clinton Foundation New York
March 9th, 2015
Women “Not there yet – on issues of gender equality”
Photo: Lacy Kiernan, Vogue.com
(Click photo to enlarge)
When a publicly recognised person comes out with criticisms against a head of state (president), which lead people to believe that a head of state must not engage in open diplomacy, then the democracy and its full implementation in that state are threatened with great instability.
I have followed closely the past week in Croatian media where almost all media outlets copied verbatim Vice Batarelo’s Facebook criticism against the president of Croatia, Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic’s for attending a meeting/forum on 9 March organised in New York by the Clinton Foundation to raise awareness that women are “not there yet on issues of gender equality”. While the media in Croatia presented Batarelo’s Facebook criticism of president Grabar-Kitarovic as a news item it certainly made its expected rounds in many a politically conscious threads of the Croatian society as some kind of proof that Grabar-Kitarovic is not a good president – because “even her conservatives are criticizing her”!
“ She should have not attended the meeting at Clinton Foundation … I think it would have been better had the president spent her time in New York or Washington with countless and very influential conservative organisations, think tanks and institutions,” wrote Batarelo in his critique, saying that “Bill and Hillary Clinton are known supporters and promoters of the culture of death, i.e. ‘for abortion’, against ‘traditional’ marriage and against other traditional values. They systematically deconstruct the traditional and conservative values upon which USA and the Western world are built. Gender equality sounds good, but it’s a screen for global promotion of killed unborn children…”.
Vice Vincent Batarelo, born in Australia in 1969 but went to live in Croatia in 1990, describes himself as a “new conservative” and had gained public recognition particularly through participating in the organisation and eventual success of the 2013 referendum that sought the definition of a marriage be included in the constitution of the state as “life union between a man and a woman”. Some describe him as a “professional Catholic”. He is the president of the Catholic Vigilare association in Croatia, which describes itself as an association that “promotes citizens’ participation in the civil and political sectors of society and the preservation of dignity and rights of the individual, family and values of life”.
To my opinion, Batarelo was either delusional or politically dishonest when he said in his critique that this meeting at Clinton Foundation was a private one and that the president of Croatia (as president) had no place being there. He acknowledges that the president needs to engage with all and cannot isolate herself but that this meeting was private! What Batarelo omits to say is that the right to encourage, the right to warn is part of the presidents role and if encouraging better rights for women takes Grabar-Kitarovic to avenues not organized by governments or states or the UN – those are the avenues she need to also take.
How “private” this meeting was could perhaps be judged by the list of influential attendees:
“ (Hillary) Clinton was joined at the event by Melinda Gates, co-chair of the Gates Foundation, and Chelsea Clinton, vice chair of the Clinton Global Initiative, which forms part of the Clinton Foundation.
Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, the first female president of Croatia, Liberian President Ellen Johnson Sirleaf, Nobel Prize laureate and education activist Malala Yousafzai and Debbie Sterling, founder of the girls construction toy company GoldieBlox all spoke at the launch,” writes NEWSWEEK.
This Batarelo’s attack on president Kolinda Grabar-Kitarovic certainly is far removed from Vigilare’s values in promoting the rights of the individual! If anything, it actually denies such rights and is hostile towards anyone who may think or acts differently to what Batarelo thinks should be done.
Batarelo’s attack against president Grabar-Kitarovic for attending a meeting in New York, organised by what he calls the left side of political orientation, his aggressive manner that’s akin to someone who appoints himself or herself as some moral arbitrator for the whole of the Croatian society – reminds me of the way things were in the former, communist Yugoslavia! In practice, the ruling communist party dominated the formal institutions of state. Power remained rooted in the communist party and, hence, anything that strayed away from its ‘moral line’/political line was dealt with swiftly, harshly and quashed in one way, or another. One could get arrested and imprisoned for attending a meeting where the agenda was not commensurate with the communist line.
The importance of civil society for the well functioning of a democracy cannot be over emphasized, and the protection and the respect of individual rights to differing opinions on matters of morality or politics fall into this category.
While Kolinda Grabar-Kitarovic aligns herself with the modern conservative political orientation and was presidential candidate of HDZ/Croatian Democratic Union it is to expected, if democracy is to survive and grow in Croatia, that her presidency will be marked by open diplomacy, that is, without hostilities towards those who think differently. She has shown that such is her way of leadership and good on her. And certainly, participating in a discussion and worldly directions of women’s rights – gender equality – or any rights for that matter, is a place which she as president should frequent and be recognized as exercising her role as president; as leader of a nation still struggling in bringing full democracy to life. Ina Vukic, Prof. (Zgb); B.A., M.A.Ps. (Syd)
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It sounds as if Mr Batarelo is not only taking the opportunity for a little self promotion by gaining some publicity but is also mixing his roles together. In order for Government to best function it should manage to do so without outside influences. In this case it sounds like the influences of the Catholic Church are being promoted as those of the state.
There’s a very good reason why the Church and State are separated in a democracy, so that all people are treated the same way. Mr Batarelo seemingly doesn’t want to give a voice to those that hold a different opinion to him.
The new Croatian President seems to be doing a sterling job so far. I hope she continues to get the support of the populace in her efforts to be fair to all.
Well put, David. Both the state and the Church have their place and certainly the Church should never meddle nor dictate to what a president must or must not do – the president’s and the government’s roles are to treat all equally and may then the majority win.
Ina, I would disagree, this time, with you. Vice Vincent John Batarelo correctly noticed that Clinton Initiative is private initiative, not USA state initiative, that was the point of his criticizing, if that was USA or UN initiative, he agrees with her being there, as a representative of Croatia. But, he disagree with her being there as Clinton Initiative is financing and giving support to abortion. She is from conservative party and he and his supporters voted for her. I do not see any problem in democratic state to criticize your president. He acted like we live in normal state, in the other hand, sicking left wing media is using his critique, for very dirty and dishonest attacks on President.
Sunny, thank you on your comment but I and great deal many disagree with Batarelo. By the same formula of his president Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic should close the door of her office – she said during her presidential election campaign and indeed on the first day she set foot into the Office that the doors of the office of the president will be open to all. Croatia too has people who are pro-life and those who are pro-choice when it comes to abortion. That is the question of conscience and personal beliefs and sometimes in medical situations, neither. Batarelo has provided not corroboration about what he says regarding the Clinton Foundation and I do not accept that. President Grabar-Kitarovic attended a very public meeting and in no way was it a private one as he claims. In democracies many organisations actually set agenda’s for governments and the rights of women is a very important one. Croatian president, as president, has the right and the duty to encourage agendas for progress in women’s rights and to do that she needs first hand reports and observations etc. I find it quite offensive when Batarelo says “his” voters voted for her as if saying “if you don’t do as we say…” Sorry but that reminds me of communist mindset – does that mean that “his” voters voted so that they could gain some benefit or perhaps some positions? I too am of conservative stock and I am very aware that every President or Prime minister will and does steer policies etc along the line of their political orientation but also they must and do consider the voters who did not vote for them because that is their duty in a democracy.
Dear Ina we all had our conviction: I point out that Hillary Clinton is and had support abortion including that USA policy that had help the crime of one child policy in China. She is also a very contradictory figure accuse of wrong doing. Attending at the function by a Croatian president will give her and company more support to the left wind feminist that believe women are better off aborting instead of giving birth! Sound hard? I thing I’m realistic!
Thank for your blog in any case that I like.
Ciao
Well Luigi, it’s quite interesting that the same Vice Batarelo who criticised Croatia’s president’s attendance of the meeting had never criticised the Croatian government ministers for meeting with the Chinese in business dealings and yet China does have an appalling child policy – with lots of abortions… In any case whether Clinton had supported abortion or not that is the same right as if supporting pro-life (no abortions) and has nothing to do with the meeting held in New York about which I write. There are conservatives also who are not pro-life just as there are those on the left. The issue of gender equality must not be confused with pro-life or pro-choice issue. Thank you on your comment
BTW, Vigilare was involved in toppling so called “Zdravstveni zakon” by Jovanović, so called “Obiteljski zakon” by Opačić, referendum about the marriage and many many other family oriented issues in Croatia. He is different voice in here, in a sea od communist propaganda, lies, lack of spirituality and honesty, Vice Vincent John Batarelo is very refreshing and smart person that should have more space in Croatian society!
One needs to earn a space in a society, Sunny, and I respect what Vigilare is achieving however being hostile towards those who hold different beliefs is just wrong and unfair. I follow closely just about everything and am well informed of Batarelo’s work.
Seems to me that Batarelo guy has appointed himself as a moral arbitrator of a nation and maybe thinks he can teach everyone a thing or two, including the most competent and world-class politician and professional as is Grabar Kitarovic. Batarelo doesn’t appear to me as a person who accepts the facts about advice and that is: advice can be taken or rejected.
Yes – too hostile and unreasonable for my taste, Wilkinson
Bravo, president Grabar-Kitarovic – gender equality is a top priority in all countries and in Croatia it needs to be addressed on many fronts not to mention the appalling wages inequality between men and women doing the same job
Hear, hear – Jessamy
A few days ago I read an article in Croatian media with the title “Is Batarelo the Catholic Ayatollah” that criticized Vice Batarelo’s approach to this meeting at Clinton Foundation in New York. So, the feeling of inappropriate criticism of the president I am sure is spread quite far and wide. I would say that even the Catholic church may be embarrassed because of it
It seems so, Robert – thank you on the comment
I am pro-life and want the whole world to be like me but I know that cannot be.
Good for you, Mason
Isn’t that Vice Batarelo a close colleague and “activist” to Stjepo Bartulica for whom people say was an adviser to the communistic ex-president of Croatia Ivo Josipovic? If so then everything he says against the left politicians is worthless but full of political dishonesty – one cannot criticize left politics (eg Clinton Foundation as Batarelo has) and break daily bread with those that helped a left oriented president of a country.
Yes, you might be onto something there, Observer 🙂
From facebook: Jesus was much criticized for being continually in the company of “tax collectors and sinners.” Jesus never has stopped calling the “sinners” even to this day. While, like me, Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović is not Jesus, she not only has the duty as our President but it is also her holy and sacred duty as a Christian, as a Catholic Christian woman, to attend such functions to wave the flag of Croatia so to speak and also to let people even of the most dubious positions in the world see and know a decent Christian woman who also happens to be our President. Kitarovic should not now nor ever apologize for what she has done in this instance. Our nation throughout the world should commend her and rejoice that she is woven of fine Christian Croatian cloth. I recommend that those who disagree with our President on this matter immediately fall to their knees and pray 100 Our Fathers and tell the rosary until daylight on the morrow or until whatever morning the light of the truth of the matter shall have come to them after which they should immediately seek confession that they may renew their lives and their faith. Until they do this, those who are snarling at our President about this need not come forward for the Holy Supper in the jurisdiction in which I hold forth.
And beside spread the good Croatian Christan name she’s also spreading good will and collaboration with all who have something important for humanity to say, David.
From facebook: Batarelo = 0, KGK = head of state. Who is Batarelo? (Almost, practically) nobody. So much for his ”criticism”. It is all about the attitude towards the president taken by all the media and political establishment in Croatia — a priori negative, questioning her every move and each step. They have never done anything close to it with the former president(s), who were OK by default, throughout their 10 +5 presidencies. This is ”democracy” we have been living in Croatia.
Yes Steven, most media is controlled by the left side, former communists or their sympathisers who take every opportunity they can to try and show her in a “bad” light. Batarelo must have known that, I believe, before he embarked on his sad and ridiculous campaign. But no matter – Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic outshines all.
It was very important that she had attended the CGI conference for many reasons. Because of the people associated with and those who support the CGI efforts world wide it gives us an opportunity to meet influential people that could benefit Croatia in other efforts. While I do not agree with everything that CGI supports the fact remains that it is a global initiative funded by many people to support common cause and needs through out the world. There are many things I do not agree with that is supported by the Gates Foundation either. But to criticize someone for attending such a universal organization really is meaningless.When ever one attends conferences you will always meet privately with people of interest as it is nothing new. There is nothing wrong to criticize your goverment if you disagree with a position they have taken that effects public policy but to condemn someone for attending a conference is petty. If he truly feels this way then he should be attacking our public policy in reference to china. They are the abortion capitol of the world but yet we negotiate all kinds of political and economic subjects with them.How about the murderous regime in Israel killing innocent women and children ? This is hypocrisy at its best. I am kind of dumb founded by what is meant by new conservative? I am always skeptical of people when people try to use catholic or any religion as part of an agenda of any organization for political reasons. Just because you hijack the word catholic such as he did does not mean he represents Catholics in any shape or form.
I agree, Michael, I do not think Batarelo represents too many Catholics and for the life of me I do not know how he can try and “blackmail”the president saying “we (my new conservatives people) voted for her…” and therefore expect certain behaviours! First of all there is absolutely no way he could be sure of how anybody actually voted, as it’s secret ballot, despite that they may have said to him yes we voted for such and such…
Well said by your comment
Yes Ina you are correct. But what is even more important to me is I know in my heart we have a leader who will be just as dismissive of him as we are and not because of arrogance. We have a strong willed educated WOMEN at the helm that will not be shaken by comments of people who are trying to make a name for themselves. Leadership is one that possesses the knowledge and understanding of when people are irrelevant and she understands that obviously as I do not see her lifting her skirt and running away from his comments even though they are not worthy of response from her.
I think so too, Michael
It seems to me Ina that reading between the lines someone is rather jealous of Kolinda’s new role, And as a head of state she is I am sure well aware of how she can help her people.
And as I view things from your posts Ina, I see someone who upholds her ideals, is truthful and is about setting right what has long been wrong..
Many thanks for sharing all you do, x Sue
Thank you, Sue – yep long time things not right but certainly the future is looking much better with efforts put in more and more
Interesting and enlightening text as always Ina
Thank you, Hollie
Ina,
Batarelo thinks differently than you, so you attacked him, and then accused him of not allowing different opinions. I don’t know if Church is embarrassed by Batarelo, but if She is, then I’m embarrassed by her.
btw. pay gap is myth, and you are just one more ridiculous progressive leftist
Well Con, never been left never will be so I do not know where you deduce your conclusions. The point of this whole thing is the attendance of the meeting on gender equality and not about left or right, it was Mr Batarelo who introduced right and left political sides into his criticism not I or anyone else. The Church is most likely embarrassed by his critique of the president attending the meeting, or at least parts of the church. But whether the church is or isn’t embarrassed it is not important in the debate for rights of women which was the agenda of the meeting in New York – there are many people who observe the church and equally as many who do not and all have something they believe in that should be respected
https://youtu.be/V4j_tm9XnJg
Regards,
Aliosa.
Thanks Aliosa
As a new leader, it’s important for Kolinda to be open-minded about certain issues and not be afraid to step into/explore gray areas. I thinks it good that she attended the Clinton Foundation.
I thinks so too, Kev – a leader of a country must be open-minded
Kolinda is simply opening all doors of communication, I hope she continues to do so.
Meeting with someone or a group or speaking for them doesn’t mean you agree with all of their positions, or even any of them.
We are talking about the potential President of the US (the other one being a Bush); the oligarchy is pushing both so she is dealing with one, likely will deal with the other at another time.
That we in the US are left to vote for two incompetent sociopathic oligarchs supported by psychopathic oligarchical sociopaths is another sad story and not a topic of discussion for this blog which focuses on Croatia and the future.
Exactly, therealamericro
Ina, I’ll just focus on the abortion issue because it is a real issue and too many people avoid it. You haven’t avoided it rather you made the point your view is that it is a personal choice. Thank you for clearing that up. The President of Croatia has not yet been clear on this matter so we have every right to ask the question.
We don’t want to condemn women but we should be doing everything to help women and save babies from the evil of abortion, it is a very serious matter.
Every life is sacred regardless of any opinion you, me or anyone else may have, period. Meaning we need to be the voice of those who can’t speak up. I don’t know anyone who believes personal choice is valid when it comes to determining ending life. Well, I lie, relativists who believe they are their own compass to moral truth. E.g. Holland & Belgium with euthanasia. It is now believed 1 in 5 of all euthanized in Holland are killed against their will the Holland Govt. has published but admit that number could be even higher. Belgium have recently passed law for euthanasia of children.
Abortion does not help anyone and sadly Melinda Gates and Hillary Clinton are massive advocates of abortion and push their agenda on the whole entire world. The irony is, anyone who speaks up the on issue gets ‘hammered’ and the hypocrisy is rife. None of us should ever stop talking about the sanctity of life, never ever, regardless of race, creed, religion, etc.
The Clinton’s are pushing their own dogma and are anti-life in every sense, and so is Melinda Gates (sterilizing women in Africa without their knowledge, etc.). We need to speak up about this and without doubt question the President why she is liaising with them at a private function, that is, democracy. We are not judging her personally yet many are ridiculed when standing up for the sanctity of life. Why????
We need all the help in the world if people start selling their dogma of ‘choice’. It is always interesting when, say for example, the Catholic Church speaks about the sanctity of life people will run far, criticize, ridicule and say The Church needs to not interfere with our lives. Really, even when discussing ‘life’??
I’m starting to wonder what people stand for when they are not clear on the issue of abortion, what is their motive, why are they pushing and promoting their dogma and ridiculing anyone who speaks of protecting life fondly. We must stand up for good no matter what and question our leaders, we do it all the time…
Again, I ask, why are people pushing their dogma when it comes to the sanctity of life. Abortion is evil and helps no one (mother, father or child). Russia was the first country to legalize abortion almost 100 years ago and Stalin was instrumental in the promotion of it. Communism (atheism) pushed their dogma and removed the meaning of ‘sanctity of life’ which also infiltrated Tito and communist Yugoslavia and sadly many Croats. Abortion helps no one yet we remain silent and put down anyone who asks the question, what do you stand for?
Countless studies show how bad abortion is for the mother but still we choose to ignore and make excuses. In Australia alone, 100,000 babies are aborted each year and is the number one contributor to mental health issues but still this information is suppressed. Why?? What is the agenda??
It’s time to stand up and talk about real issues and ABORTION is a real issue and impacts every aspect of life, here, in Croatia and the whole world. It affects the core of society, families, it affects the economy, health, etc. at a real cost. Investigate further and you will also question the Gates & Clintons.
FYI, please view the following videos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gON-8PP6zgQ
(this video explains what abortion actually is, this comes from the world leader of modern abortion in the U.S.)
http://www.sneakymag.com/life/video-we-spoke-to-the-surry-hills-anti-abortion-group/
(a short video from last week in Sydney outside the Surry Hills abortion mill)
I will gladly read or watch any counter argument about the ‘sanctity of life’ you wish to pass on for further discussion.
Although it may not be obvious, in my opinion, your article and comments largely reflect the issue you have with the ‘sanctity of life’ and the so called moralizing of others (re Vice’s comments). Well, if saying abortion is bad for you and that every life is precious and asking a president what they stand for on this issue is ‘moralizing’, then you can unfortunately include me in this group whatever that means!
I am moralized on myriad of issues everyday by my boss, wife, friends, government, speed limit, many other organizations and I do the same with my children and sometimes to my wife and friends! But I genuinely believe we care for each other so we do it out of love.
We ALL make judgements all day, everyday and we well know the Clintons and Gates actively promote abortion financially and morally (sounds horrible, but abortion is the conscience ending of life, and legally, we all know what that is called??).
To make it clear, YES, I am passing judgement on your article and the people mentioned in your article hence this long ‘reply’. I respect that you have a right of reply and although I may not agree with you it is absolutely your right..
Thank you again for the opportunity to reply to this most important issue facing us today, tomorrow and the future.
Kind Regards
Thank you Tetak, the meeting in New York for which the President was criticised was not about abortion but about women’s rights in gender equality so please keep to that rather than what opinion about abortion the Clinton Foundation might have or might not. and by the way president Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic did state during her campaign that personally she is against abortion but that there are others who may need an abortion due to medical reasons etc etc As for gender equality I WANT OUR DAUGHTERS TO RECEIVE SAME PAY AS MEN COLLEAGUES FOR SAME JOB DONE – Pro -choice and Pro-life are issue of conscience and as far as I have seen in a democracy both are respected and the one which gets most votes becomes law whether we like it or not.
Have no problem with equal pay at all.
Wow, I am shocked at the absolute apathy regarding abortion. Of course it is all linked. This is oxy-moronic, abortion is linked to the topic because the Gates & Clintons so actively promote it falsely claiming it is a woman’s right/choice and that it is good for them and that’s who our President was with.
It just sounds like it’s not a big deal, I am truly saddened by such a response, it’s like, whatever…. I am shocked. I ask you again, is it worth us fighting for the ‘sanctity of life’?? Or not??
I would love your response on:
Do you want to see more abortions??
And are we doing enough to eradicate it??
And please give me data on abortions in Croatia or anywhere else in the world required for medical reasons.
Does that mean you only believe in abortions that are, so called required for medical reasons?? What is etc. etc (what reasons??).
Are you saying that Kolinda Grabar Kitarovic is unequivocally opposed to abortion if it is not for ‘medical reasons’? If so, or no, what is she going to do about it?? We need to know…
And I understand why you will not be pursuing this most important matter because we have been absolutely numbed by abortion. We truly don’t believe it is the killing of life and that is the vibe I get from your response.
I would truly like to understand your stance since you stand on the conservative side of politics and recognize the evil of communism but don’t see how they brought abortion to Croatia. According to the UN Russia had the highest number of abortions per women in the world with the average Russian women having 7/8 abortions. That is the fruit of communism (atheism & relativism).
What is our moral compass for this issue? Yourself…??
I will never remain silent on the killing of babies just as we were told during the Yugoslav-era that they were right and everything Croatian or religious was bad.
Killing babies (abortion) is bad no matter what, so we need to ask our President the hard questions and not get defensive. This is a matter of life and death.
I would appreciate if you could watch the youtube links and I look forward to your response and associated data.
I am on topic and it is absolutely relevant.
Thank you.
Tetak, I am personally against abortion. I live in a democratic society where opinions/choices, not regulated by law, of everyone, whether we like them or not, are respected as a right. I disagree with you that the meeting in New York was to promote abortions. As to abortions for medical reasons there is plenty of information to access on the net. President does not make or pass the laws of Croatia, the government does.
Ina, I have been searching the net and please help me by sending me any reputable links to when abortions are necessary for medical reasons. You seem to be aware of them and I would love to receive for further reading & investigation. As for the meeting please remember why she went there and by which criteria, I’m sure many would comment if she met with militant muslim groups about feeding the hungry children of Europe (another noble cause) or with communists on how we can all better serve the disabled (another noble cause). Or would that no draw a response because it was for a ‘good cause’.
Ina, make absolutely no mistake, ‘black and white’, the Clinton’s and Gate’s actively in every way support (financially and morally) and lobby for abortion, sterilization, gay marriage and so on. None of which is good for Croatia, Europe and the world and its citizens regardless of race, creed, gender and religion. Or do we still ignore the facts??
Please help me understand…
Oh Tetak, you seem to be so interested that I find it incredulous you cannot find information on abortions for medical reasons – Medical reasons for abortion, while not as common, present much more difficult choices for the pregnant woman. Some women end up choosing abortion to prevent the birth of a child with serious medical problems while others have their own medical issues that could mean risking death or severe injury if the pregnancy is carried to term… I think you have your mind made up on many issues that fall into right of choice in life and one can only understand these if one is willing to acknowledge that different people make different choices on same matters and no man can really say who is right and who is wrong – perhaps God will one day. As to the president’s meeting in New York I disagree with you: women’s rights cover a great plethora of issues not just abortion as you seem to favour as issue.
Ina, I am absolutely fixated on what is right and good for humanity, aren’t you?? Isn’t that the reason for your blog page, to spread the good news and stand up for what is true and good for us?? I applaud you for making your viewpoint via this forum.
But sadly it seems most people get very defensive when we talk about ending the life of another human (choice??) yet we are most comfortable with telling each other what to do in almost every other circumstance and then legislate accordingly. Can you please tell me what is more important than the ‘sanctity of life’? Maybe I’m missing something…
Please watch the youtube link sent earlier, ‘The Silent Scream’ which was produced by the father of modern day abortion.
I will say it again because people for some strange reason are numbed by the fact that the Clinton’s & Gate’s have teamed up with the largest abortion providers (Ipas, Planned Parenthood, and Marie Stopes) in the world for them to spread their IDEOLOGY, yet when we stand up and speak against it then we are labelled and marginalized as ‘judgmental’, ‘moralizers’, ‘extremist’, ‘too religious’ and I could go on. You have done it in your comment above (inferring I judge others in a negative way), of course, there is a right and wrong, of course I don’t understand every situation people are going through, of course, WE judge (please tell me who does not and how you survive without making judgement calls) and so on, etc. What is your point??
I will make it very clear, abortion is wrong and it is sadly the killing of a baby that has no voice or choice. Statistically, most mothers feel like they have no choice and don’t want to proceed. Why not help them?? It is good and healthy for them to have the baby and the studies show this. This is not even a religious argument, it is a case for what is good for humans and the people involved. Major secular studies support this! Why don’t we help them and stand up for them???????? Why??
Are we being lied to, surely not, the Clintons & Gates wouldn’t do that when it comes to women?????
If you were to investigate numbers and speak to Croats in Croatia & Bosna you would would very quickly see the affects of abortion. Sadly, Slavonia has been crippled by abortion (plus more) stemming back from the days of the former yugoslavia. It is in many ways the ‘elephant in the room’. We are living with the after affects and nothing has been done on a large scale (systematically/education) to fix the problem and help the people affected and future generations. It is in many ways a silent killer but understandably politicians find it very difficult to discuss because it is ‘politically incorrect’ and you would be labelled all sorts of names and most likely, be thrown/voted out and ‘hammered’ by the public & media.
Abortion is a topic that is hurtful and emotive to talk about so people will try to forget about it but sadly will never go away for the people affected. There is so much I could share specific to Croatia but I won’t go on any more, but nonetheless to say, if we are interested in ‘what is good for women’ in Croatia and even beyond we would discuss the facts about abortion, share the truth and share the real solutions, none of which are ‘easy fixes’. It has to be a long term strategy (generational).
If we agree abortion is WRONG, we can stand up together and stand up for all mothers, fathers and children affected by the scourge of abortion. We should be doing everything possible individually, as a society, as a nation, etc. to absolutely HELP all mothers found in this situation all the time, every time no exceptions. We need policies and funding to support them, we need the likes of Gates & Clintons to redirect their funds to HELP WOMEN. If you disagree, then sadly we will part ways fighting on opposite ends on this most important issue of ‘sanctity of life’. And by your silence you will support abortion.
Open your heart and mind and read up on the issue, I did and was amazed where the truth lies.
GK Chesterton once said “Men do not differ much about what things they will call evils; they differ enormously about what evils they will call excusable” and “Truth is sacred; and if you tell the truth too often nobody will believe it.”
“I feel the greatest destroyer of peace today is ‘Abortion’, because it is a war against the child… A direct killing of the innocent child, ‘Murder’ by the mother herself… And if we can accept that a mother can kill even her own child, how can we tell other people not to kill one another? How do we persuade a woman not to have an abortion? As always, we must persuade her with love… And we remind ourselves that love means to be willing to give until it hurts…”
― Mother Teresa
I am unashamedly a follower of Jesus and he is our moral compass, not my own thoughts or ideas (‘relativism’).
Who should be the moral compass for humanity?? Should it be a person, a govt., a foundation, etc. or by whom??
We have all fallen and will fall again but we can confess and repent, it’s a beautiful thing! It is not damnation but salvation. I am absolutely no saint but we try and there is hope by following Jesus. Lets help all women and share with them the truth about their choices and we will save many for the greater good. And yes, it is not easy, we will judge, others will judge us, you may be marginalized, but all for what is good for women and humanity!
I understand this is a most difficult topic and I hope I haven’t turned you away from it. I don’t proclaim to do the topic justice but I do try and will continue to do so!
I live in Sydney and I would be happy to communicate offline should you wish!
To you and your family, mir i dobro
A happy and Holy Easter!
Thank you Tetak, happy Easter to you and your family also.
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/hillary-clinton-religious-beliefs-that-oppose-abortion-have-to-be-changed
Thank you for the link, Tetak – it provides an opinion or two on issues that divide thinking just as child abuse and pedophilia in “church circles” do
Divided thinking on ‘child abuse & pedophilia’ in church circles??
Child abuse & pedophilia ANYWHERE is always wrong PERIOD regardless of what anyone may say, think or do about it.
Your comment has slightly confused me…
Opinions are one thing but truth is another. There is only one TRUTH.
But opinions based on truth have more weight as opinions than those that are not, Tetak
True! And I totally agree.
Hillary Clinton supports NARAL, Planned Parenthood, etc. all who support, promote, provide abortion and sell baby body parts. Is this good for women? Or will we say they don’t? Or maybe even defend it?
Check out word for word the tweet from yesterday from NARAL which is UNBELIEVABLE. They attack Doritos for showing this ad during the superbowl stating ‘humanizing fetuses’?? Really…
NARAL @NARAL
#NotBuyingIt – that @Doritos ad using #antichoice tactic of humanizing fetuses & sexist tropes of dads as clueless & moms as uptight. #SB50
11:07 AM – 8 Feb 2016
I’m wondering if you believe Hillary Clinton is doing good things for women??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh_gOK6xDNA
Awful terrible ad if you ask me, Tetak – made in bad taste and it put me off Doritos for sure
Check out the tweet from yesterday below upset at showing a baby in an ultrasound claiming it, and I quote, “humanizing fetuses”.
This is from NARAL which Hillary Clinton supports and she also supports Planned Parenthood which sells baby body parts. Or are we going to deny that, or maybe even defend it??
My question, is Hillary Clinton doing good work for women??
NARAL @NARAL
#NotBuyingIt – that @Doritos ad using #antichoice tactic of humanizing fetuses & sexist tropes of dads as clueless & moms as uptight. #SB50
11:07 AM – 8 Feb 2016
Is Hillary Clinton doing good work for women – answer: in some cases most probably yes in some cases no so pick and choose the side that suits you Tetak 🙂